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Planning to be a Battle Master War Cleric
#1
For this upcoming campaign (right now we're doing just free-form RP before actual stats and classes matter), I was confused (and so was my character) as to who I wanted to be. At first, as a Half-Elf, I wanted to be a ranger. But then I felt as if (as my character) I didn't want to be too much like my father, so I decided to "change majors" at this military academy to pursue the wizardly arts. And like before, I couldn't fully commit to that path. And then, while I was RPing with another party member, I realized that I wanted to be able to protect them whenever I could seeing as there was a severe lack of melee fighting now that we had lost our fighter. So I decided to become a fighter myself, since that's a more user-friendly class for a relative beginner.

But I also wanted to do something more. I wanted some sort of direction in my life. And so, I decided that down the road, my character will eventually travel to a temple of Torm that exists within Waterdeep (our campaign is taking place in the Sword Coast) and is the home to a guild of holy bounty hunters called the Dragon's Fang (of which my character's father is already an existing member as a ranger/cleric). Upon my arrival, he plans to pursue that path out of wanting to protect people from those who are corrupt and unjust. But more than anything, he wants to no longer feel a disconnect he'd had since he was a child.

So yeah, there's that. And I might as well share who my character is as well as his starting equipment and ability scores (and these are after a re-roll which my DM was very gracious about):

Name: Leomorn Moonshadow
Race: Half-Elf
Alignment: Chaotic Good
Class #1: Fighter (Battle Master)
Class #2: Cleric (War Domain)

Level: 1
Hit Points: 12/12
Armor Class: 19

Languages: Common, Elvish, Draconic

Ability Scores
STR 18 (17+1 from racial bonus)
DEX 16
CON 15
INT 14
WIS 18 (17+1 from racial bonus)
CHA 15 (13+2 from racial bonus)

Hair: Blonde
Eyes: Green
Skin: Normal
Size: Medium
Height: 5'10"
Weight: 122 lb.

Class Traits: Defense Fighting Style, Second Wind

Racial Traits: Fey Ancestry, Darkvision, Skill Versatility

Fighting Equipment: Longsword, chain mail, shield

List of Skills Proficient In:
As a Half-Elf: Religion, Investigation
As a Fighter: Perception, History
As an Urban Bounty Hunter: Insight, Persuasion, thieves' tools, lute

What do you guys think?
My YouTube channel for VG commentary playthroughs. Come check it out of you want.
Proud supporter of Vaxleth, an adventurer looking for campaigns to join, and just an avid fan of Critical Role.
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#2
So based on your background you are starting off with a fighter then when you get to level 2, multi-classing to a cleric?

FYI. A War Cleric can function as a tank just fine if you use the right build, especially with the stats you rolled if being the party tank was your original intent.
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#3
(01-27-2016, 12:20 PM)fmacanadaguy Wrote: So based on your background you are starting off with a fighter then when you get to level 2, multi-classing to a cleric?

FYI.  A War Cleric can function as a tank just fine if you use the right build, especially with the stats you rolled if being the party tank was your original intent.

Well, due to our original fighter leaving around the time I was reconsidering my options, yes, that is the plan.

Actually, I was thinking of taking fighter levels until I get to that point where I become a cleric in the story.

My plan (at the moment) is to take War Caster at Fighter 4, and then Resilient (WIS) at Fighter 6 so that I can gain proficiency on Wisdom saves.

Then, down the line, I'll take +1 to Wisdom and +1 to Constitution at Cleric 4 or Fighter 6. After that, it depends on where the story goes.

Although, with that in mind, in your opinion when would be a good time to stop taking Fighter levels?
My YouTube channel for VG commentary playthroughs. Come check it out of you want.
Proud supporter of Vaxleth, an adventurer looking for campaigns to join, and just an avid fan of Critical Role.
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#4
One problem is that you can't take warcaster unless you already can cast a spell so you can't take that feat until total level 5.

An issue that will probably experience is feeling disappointed due to the slow payoff because leveling won't all that quick for what you are going for.

Let me help lay this out if you went full cleric. Remember that you are never born into a class, you become it. Nothing in what you wrote says you can't just be a cleric of the war domain after being some kind of soldier. That is what the soldier background can be for.

Swap your Dex and Con stats. That will give you an extra HP. If you want more HP, be a hill dwarf. Extra 1 HP per level and more CON so you wouldn't have to swap the scores. There is also human if you want to start off with a feat like Tough. Just presenting those options but I won't focus on them.

1st level, you have 2 attacks already. A fighter would not. You can also drop shield of faith for a +2 to AC which would be one more than you'd have as a fighter with the defense style. Two attacks, 20 AC, 11 HP if the DM has you start at max (Hill dwarf would be 12, human with tough would be 13). Great first level tank.

2nd level. You need a crucial hit. Give yourself +10 to it.

3rd level, you can forgo the limitation of only being able to do 2 attacks 4 times per rest now thanks to spiritual weapon. Cast your spiritual weapon which can attack using your spell attack modifier. Doesn't require concentration and moves 20 ft under your control. Now you have this as standby in case you use up your 4 attacks in a previous battle that same day.

Also, assuming half elf and taking the average HP of 5 with CON of 16 and DM had you start at max HP, you should have 27 HP by now. Decent. Get yourself full plate, 22 AC with spell.

4th level. Decision time. Can you get by without warcaster? If so, take Tough. You immediately gain 8 extra HP. Now you have 43 HP. You get in trouble in HP, cure yourself.

Look pretty good so far?

6th level. You can give yourself +10 to hit twice or do it to someone else in the group.

8th level. You can add an extra 1D8 damage once per round when you hit. Almost (albeit not quite) like having 3 attacks per round. A fighter wouldn't get this until 11th. Also here you can insert warcaster or tough if you took warcaster before. At this point, assuming taking average HP per level, you would have 80 HP due to Tough feat.

See how this is shaping up so far? You are 8th level so you have 4th level spells. You have 80 HP and AC is 22 assuming full plate, shield and spell. No magic items factored in. You have 2 attacks per round using either your spiritual weapon and your attack, or your cleric feature. Plus you add another 1D8 when you hit which you can decide if you want to by adding +10 to it.



Now lets review what would it would be like as a fighter - cleric

1st level: Fighter: 1 attack per round. You can heal yourself once as a bonus action with second wind. A cleric could try this with healing word as well. 1D10+CON vs 1D4+WIS. Better than cleric but cleric has other spell options too. May not need to heal if shield of faith is used and you have 20 AC to avoid the hits you took.

2nd level: Fighter: Action surge. You can do two things per short rest. During combat, two attacks. Single class war cleric would already have this.

3rd level: Fighter: Battlemaster time. 3 maneuvers. Can be used 4 times per short rest. Very nice. Choose maneuvers wisely.

4th level: Cleric: You need it to take warcaster at your 4th fighter level. You'll get 2 attacks now because war cleric. Shield of faith can be used now as well for more AC. Assuming full plate and shield and defense style, 23 AC.

5th level: Fighter: Now you can feat with warcaster. By this time, your HP will be 48 assuming taking average HP gain.

6th level: Fighter: Push fighter so you can get to 6th fighter for the next feat. You now have 3 attacks though as war cleric. You are fighter 5 / Cleric 1

7th level: Fighter: New feat. Resilient? Extra for saving throws making your WIS save +7 now.

8th level: Cleric: Can add +10 to an attack roll once per rest and extra spell slot.

9th level: Cleric: Now you have 2nd level spells. Spiritual weapon if you want.

10th level: Cleric: Still only second level spells. Not much change again. Fighter 6 / Cleric 4.

So you, at this point, have access to 3 different maneuvers and 2nd level cleric spells. HP 90 assuming average, 3 attacks per round (either with war cleric ability or using spiritual weapon) and AC 23 with spell but before applying any magic item modifiers.

Now alternatively you could go for the two attacks and more AC early and take cleric at level 2. It may change the feel for you or it may not. But you'd need to do it before fighter 4 if you want the warcaster feat. It depends on which you like more. Action surge or the cleric level.
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#5
(01-27-2016, 02:23 PM)fmacanadaguy Wrote: One problem is that you can't take warcaster unless you already can cast a spell so you can't take that feat until total level 5.



Now lets review what would it would be like as a fighter - cleric

1st level: Fighter: 1 attack per round.  You can heal yourself once as a bonus action with second wind.  A cleric could try this with healing word as well. 1D10+CON vs 1D4+WIS.  Better than cleric but cleric has other spell options too.  May not need to heal if shield of faith is used and you have 20 AC to avoid the hits you took.

2nd level: Fighter: Action surge.  You can do two things per short rest.  During combat, two attacks.  Single class war cleric would already have this.

3rd level: Fighter: Battlemaster time.  3 maneuvers.  Can be used 4 times per short rest.  Very nice.  Choose maneuvers wisely.

4th level: Cleric: You need it to take warcaster at your 4th fighter level.  You'll get 2 attacks now because war cleric.  Shield of faith can be used now as well for more AC. Assuming full plate and shield and defense style, 23 AC.

5th level: Fighter: Now you can feat with warcaster.  By this time, your HP will be 48 assuming taking average HP gain.

6th level: Fighter:  Push fighter so you can get to 6th fighter for the next feat.  You now have 3 attacks though as war cleric.  You are fighter 5 / Cleric 1

7th level: Fighter: New feat.  Resilient? Extra for saving throws making your WIS save +7 now.

8th level: Cleric: Can add +10 to an attack roll once per rest and extra spell slot.

9th level: Cleric: Now you have 2nd level spells.  Spiritual weapon if you want.

10th level: Cleric: Still only second level spells.  Not much change again.  Fighter 6 / Cleric 4.  

So you, at this point, have access to 3 different maneuvers and 2nd level cleric spells.  HP 90 assuming average, 3 attacks per round (either with war cleric ability or using spiritual weapon) and AC 23 with spell but before applying any magic item modifiers.

Now alternatively you could go for the two attacks and more AC early and take cleric at level 2.  It may change the feel for you or it may not.  But you'd need to do it before fighter 4 if you want the warcaster feat.  It depends on which you like more.  Action surge or the cleric level.

That's true. I totally forgot about War Caster requiring the ability to cast spells. Oops. Also, I'm actually hoping to eventually ditch my chain mail for studded leather without switching DEX and CON. Sure, with everything I have, I'll have -1 AC, but at least I'll be lighter and not have stealth disadvantage. As for the Fighter/Cleric level choices:

1st level: I was planning on sticking to Fighter as my original class.

2nd level: Action Surge is always nice.

3rd level: It didn't feel right to be an Eldritch Knight AND a cleric, so I went with Battle Master.

4th level: Thinking ahead, yeah, it would be better if I were a Cleric at this level.

5th level: You're right. THIS is the ideal time to be a War Caster.

6th level: Extra attacks are always nice.

7th level: Definitely getting Resilient (WIS) at this point for 19 Wisdom.

8th level: I'll go Cleric for this one too.

9th level: Spiritual Weapon is already provided for free with War Domain.

10th level: True, I'd only have second-level spells, but at least I can cap my WIS at 20 and make my CON 16, therefore adding more HP to my existing max.

Truth be told, I doubt that there are that many more feats that would be beneficial to me as a Battle Master Cleric. So do you think that Fighter 6 is good enough while I go the rest of the way with Cleric?
My YouTube channel for VG commentary playthroughs. Come check it out of you want.
Proud supporter of Vaxleth, an adventurer looking for campaigns to join, and just an avid fan of Critical Role.
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#6
Did you roll stats or are you using some insane point buy? Your level one is better than most level 8-12s.
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#7
(01-27-2016, 08:31 PM)Andre Wrote: Did you roll stats or are you using some insane point buy?  Your level one is better than most level 8-12s.

I rolled. My rolls were a 13, 14, 15, 16, and two 17s. I kid you not.

And actually, I shifted my scores around since we're not making them official until our free-form RP ends and the actual campaign begins.

I also changed my background to Sage and took the Dwarvish and Orc languages since my character was originally quite the bookworm.

So my proficient skills are now Arcana, History, Insight, Perception, Religion, and Investigation.

Plus, I bought my own equipment with 5d4 x 10, getting 160 GP. And this is what I purchased:

Total Gold: 160 GP
Item (Value) / Total Spent
Studded Leather (45 GP) / 45
Shield (10 GP) / 55
Shortsword (10 GP) / 65
Shortbow (25 GP) / 90
Quiver (1 GP) / 91
20 Arrows (1 GP) / 92
Scholar's Pack (40 GP) / 132
Shortbow (25 GP) / 157
Quiver (1 GP) / 158
20 Arrows (1 GP) / 159
Common Clothes (5 SP) / 159.5

The extra shortbow and quiver w/ arrows is for another party member.
My YouTube channel for VG commentary playthroughs. Come check it out of you want.
Proud supporter of Vaxleth, an adventurer looking for campaigns to join, and just an avid fan of Critical Role.
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#8
TiamatZX... that is all well and good. Would you be willing to try giving yourself one negative stat? I'm pretty sure you will end up being bored with this character rather quickly, unless you purely plan on power gaming.

mentalburnout has a pretty good thread going here on these boards at http://forum.crittersrpg.com/showthread.php?tid=68
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#9
(02-03-2016, 11:02 PM)Adam Owczarek Wrote: TiamatZX... that is all well and good.  Would you be willing to try giving yourself one negative stat?  I'm pretty sure you will end up being bored with this character rather quickly, unless you purely plan on power gaming.

mentalburnout has a pretty good thread going here on these boards at http://forum.crittersrpg.com/showthread.php?tid=68

I wasn't exactly planning on power gaming. That was just how lucky my rolls were.

And besides, you gotta recall that this is my first time actually being in a full D&D campaign, so I'm still learning. Plus, I don't plan on trying to do everything myself; my job is to be defensive and have monsters focus on me so that my party members can get their attacks in.
My YouTube channel for VG commentary playthroughs. Come check it out of you want.
Proud supporter of Vaxleth, an adventurer looking for campaigns to join, and just an avid fan of Critical Role.
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#10
Have fun in your first full campaign, that is exciting!

I most remind you, that very few mechanics actually make anything focus on you... so that part of your plan is up to how your DM Smiling
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